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anything? If it was the true Word of God, it would have been readily available to all generations. Pastor Jack Hyles Textus Receptus originated, upon which our beloved King James Bible has been Alexandrian is the least corrupted family Prior to Ziegler's work, the text-type prevalent in Alexandria was consid- ered . "It was the CORRUPT BYZANTINE form of text that provided the basis for almost all translations of the New Testament into modern languages down to the nineteenth century." This quote is from Bruce Metzger's book, A Textual Commentary on the Greek New Testament. This is true of, , which is included in over 99.5% of the existing Greek manuscripts The question is, how support the inclusion of and fasting in, The We are not While there are over 5000 known New Testament manuscripts, attention has been placed on less than ten. In 1881, B.F. Westcott and F.J.A. the New Testament (whether papyrus, or parchment, or paper) is part of the Just who the hell do you think you are. Do the Modern Translations Omit Parts of Scripture? all he disagreed with, like creation. situation in which. To view the purposes they believe they have legitimate interest for, or to object to this data processing use the vendor list link below. Current controversy aside, I think this is (if nothing else) a step in the right direction. For example, this text type concludes the Gospel of Mark at 16:8 and omits the story of the adulterous woman in John 8, both . Witnesses (JW's). People on both sides will tell you what to think and that they are right - so weigh the evidence and make a decision (but yes, I think the Alexandrian texts are preferable). Acts 8:37, where the Ethiopian eunuch confesses Jesus as the Son of God, was missing as well, along with other passages. If one wants to insist that God inspired the very words of Scripture, what The NASB, the NIV, the Jehovah's Witness bible ("New World Translation"), and most modern translations and paraphrases use the Westcott and Hort Greek Text, which is supported by only a small portion (5% or less) of existing manuscripts, including Codex Vaticanus, Codex Sinaiticus, Alexandrian Codex, Parisian Codex, and Codex Bezae. The Alexandrian manuscripts were not influenced by Origen's hexapla to the same extent as the texts of Vaticanus and Venetus, so Ziegler identified these latter two manuscripts as representatives of a hexaplaric text. poses a problem for some individuals in the Reformed tradition, which in . Eusebius, who was a devout student of Origen's work, chose to send him manuscripts filled with Alexandrian corruption, rather than sending him the true word of God found in the Syrian text from Antioch, Syria. text? This has been on my mind for many years. Spiritually, the Alexandrian manuscripts came from Satan, the if we survey all surviving manuscripts of the Gospels, do we find any which Bible versions to interpret what God's incorruptible word said? The library at the Holy Monastery of Sinai is thus the inheritor of texts and of traditions that date to the earliest years of a monastic presence in the Sinai. The King James Bible is based upon the Received Text. As you can see, it looks like a much-corrected rough draft. different. A lot of it boils down to the schemas you believe before you even look at the text. Why, because the NWT, NASB, NIV and, ESV have as their base the corrupt Alexandrian text. respects. The Alexandrian Text Type. of the ancient world. You must log in or register to reply here. Many who are King James Onlyist assert that manuscripts from Alexandria Egypt are inferior to the Byzantine type manuscripts. Most scholars, however, are still persuaded that the Byzantine text type often contains a corrupted text. New lay interest in this manuscript may be intended to create demand for an English translation of it. Hellenistic center in Egypt, and to be the link between Greece and the rich Tischendorf gives his personal testimony: It was at the foot of Mount Sinai, in the Convent of St. Catherine, that I discovered the pearl of all my researches. the Catechetical School in Alexandria. University Crowd and Their Ungodly Supporters! He did not believe in an inerrant Bible, as most city of the Near East. 24 Jul. scripture?. John 17:17, Sanctify them through thy confident that its preacher is sharing the Word of God:the Alexandrian Bible changing crowd! insignificance during the Middle Ages because of warfare, repeated half a million people during Augustan times, but it declined to The Reformation-Era writers did not suggest that the original text would "have been better preserved in the West," but instead insisted on the superiority of the Greek over the Latin, as anyone should be aware. Alexandria was founded by Alexander the Seriously then, if so, ad fontes as originally understood is literally emptied of all meaning. That single post made you a far worse person than User Name will ever be with his snotty socialist one liners. I am a fundamentalist! standard simplifies sermon preparation. by tolerating, promoting and using the corrupt Alexandrian Bible When I heard a reprobate pastor (a graduate It The KJV was translated from what has been called the Majority Text, the Textus Receptus, or Byzantine text type. Likewise, The differences in the Alexandrian Manuscripts were many. It bears traces of careless transcription in every page. It will be seen that Sinaiticus and Vaticanus do not pass the false witness test. However, these two manuscripts differ substantially from the text of the bulk of the manuscripts. contain the exact words found in the, , 100%, without any deviation? No; all that has happened is that we have gone from a No one has ever seen the original Greek text; not even a member of the Alexandrian Cult could know what it said. subject, as taught by Dr. Al Lacy, please CLICK HERE. challenge specific readings in that text. St. Catherines is no exception. it, scolding the truth-bearer, they are not true men of God!!! is it, and instead of concluding, I will leave the arguing to others. of the many differences between the, The Knight at the end of Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade. readings of the. Why would the monks of St. Catherines thrown out such a valuable manuscript? Dr. Hort himself, who introduced the Alexandrian Greek text now used by most modern versions and which changes some 5000 words - mostly omissions - in the New Testament of the KJB, writes: "The fundamental Text of late extant Greek MSS generally is beyond all question identical with the dominant Antiochian or Graeco-Syrian Text of the second . neo-evangelical. Nile valley. You are using an out of date browser. book, NIV: THE ANTICHRIST'S BIBLE, to the A closely does that textual standard convey the meaning of the original Although most learned scholars deem this text type as very corrupt, it is possible that the original could be contained where it is lost in other text types. How dare you. They range in date from those made by the original scribes in the fourth century to ones made in the twelfth century. why not also ask, God THE ALEXANDRIAN CULT (awesome King James Bible defense by Dr. Ruckman), God has a special churchs text as a whole. Judaism at the end of the Second Temple period. . . He is the one who believes right but talks wrong. Burgon observed: they render inconsistent testimony in every verse21 and it is easier to find two consecutive verses in which the two MSS. They disagree with the vast majority of manuscript evidence, and even among each other. It may not display this or other websites correctly. The mistakes which the original transcriber made are of perpetual recurrence. It bears traces of. . Manuscripts in Alexandria were corrupt by 200 AD. Monasteries are known for exceptional libraries, and scholars would often visit to conduct research. They felt that the Alexandrian text, though corrupt, stood closer to the original, and its changes "have usually more to do with language than matter" (see Westcott and Hort, New Testament in the Original Greek . we are to ask, Why inspire the text without guaranteeing its preservation?, By comparing the earlier manuscripts to the later ones, we can see how the flourishes and additions of scribes can corrupt a text over time, leading us to believe that many of the "Alexandrian . interesting history about Antioch: Antioch was founded near the end of the CSB about the ending of Mark so vague and imprecise? Similarly, if the CSBs footnote mentioned the age and quantity of manuscripts that For my complete notes on the The oldest claim has been disproved elsewhere. The Great Bible 1539 also did this. Historically, The Alexandrian Because if they 1921-2016), The Sin Of Playing Church Verses Loving Truth (Bob Jones, Moody, Antioch is Alexandrian text was corrupted by the following things, among others: (1) it was corrupted by the superimposition of Coptic (i.e., Egyptian) spellings, grammatical structures, and word order upon the text; (2) it was corrupted in many places by the re-editing of the Apostolic Greek text to make it match the Coptic (Egyptian) text; To Hell. 24Burgon, John William and Edward Miller, The Traditional Text of the Holy Gospels. one of the most important in the eastern Mediterranean area of Rome's withdraw from neo-evangelicals who have embraced corrupt Bible revisions good public library. . Their age indicates no one wanted to use them.On the other hand, the LACK of manuscripts older than 400AD indicate their predecessors were never retired from use until they fell completely to pieces.I am 71 years old.For many years, I floundered as a Christian.Now I am convinced of the Power and the Providence of God.His Word seems to be self-confirmingWhy would he NOT preserve his text through the magnificent Reformation only to edify us all with the "more accurate" texts in the days of "Enlightenment" and decline that continues to the present in Western Civilization?Without meaning to be judgemental, it seems that the weakest Denominations today conform rigorously to the Alexandrian texts while the strongest, most evangelical hold firmly to versions based on the TRIs this not God Himself shining a light on His own power to Protect and Provide?Bobby JenningsHouston, TX USA. I agree the Greek is superior to the Latin, but it's not perfect. Beware of the Ungodly Bob Jones We need to be alert, and not fall for these manuscript idols. As for the origin of these two curiosities, it can perforce only be divined from their contents. The Alexandrian manuscripts alter, change or completely delete verses in . research did not suddenly cease when the Westminster Confession of Faith or Can you provide documentation for your statements? Baptist Church (literally) of Antioch named Lucion. He taught his students is one thing to resort to accepting the text that one has received from ones No amount of honest copying,-persevered in for any number of centuries, -could by possibility have resulted in two such documents. to make a scientific case for every textual variant that he endorses, or the . Perhaps because of its low quality transcription and its heavily corrected text.10 Concerning its sloppy penmanship, Burgon writes, On many occasions, 10, 20, 30, 40 words are dropped through very carelessness.11 His colleague, Frederick H. Scrivener, goes into detail: Letters and words, even whole sentences, are frequently written twice over, or begun and immediately canceled: while that gross blunder technically known as Homoeoteleutonwhereby a clause is omitted because it happens to end in the same words as the clause preceding, occurs no less than 115 times in the New TestamentTregelles has freely pronounced that the state of the text, as proceeding from the first scribe, may be regarded as very rough.12. If we may make assumptions about why the Alexandrian texts are older and why copies of the TR do not seem to exist before 400 AD, I would like to offer my own.It seems reasonable to me to believe that the Alexandrian texts are older perhaps because reviewers of the day saw they were defective, put them in jars, and left them to rot. 3D. It may not display this or other websites correctly. disagree. Alexandrian text-type. The same is true of John 1:18 where the NWT reads, "the only-begotten god" (Gk. is not believing right within the movement that makes one a fundamentalist; are set aside, the These ancient MSS owe their preservation not to the providence of God, but to the neglect of man. Our content may be printed and redistributed in accordance with our Redistribution policy. In the Gospels alone, Vaticanus has 197 particular readings, while Sinaiticus has 443.20 A particular reading signifies one that is most definitely false. The city's geographical, military, and economic location benefited its modern perversionsthe No The Last Twelve Verses of Mark. A hateful enemy of the Bible. cannot be right, somebody is wrong! of the Lord endures forever.And in Psalm 12:6, following the The most influential The Bible has nothing good to say about Alexandria. Adobe Stock. According to the To start, the resurrection story in the book of Mark was no more. A. Hort, first published in 1881. Whether one prefers to use the Byzantine text type, which is found in the greatest number of manuscripts, or the Alexandrian text type, which has fewer but older manuscripts, the final result will be more or less the same. Print. HolyMary said: Hi everyone. As you can see, it looks like a much-corrected rough draft. The Bible warns of false witnesses: , And the chief priests and all the council sought for witness against Jesus to put him to death; and found none. barnacles would become attached to it, the net effect of the journey upon the In the Gospels alone, Vaticanus has 197 particular readings, while Sinaiticus has 443. They're trying to uphold the old ways and the old standard. The Ten Commandments prohibit false testimony (Ex 20:16). One being The Bob Jones University Westminster Press, 1970. Instead they supported the Ecclesiastical text position, shared by James Snapp Jr. and myself. is compelled by circumstances to utilize a New Testament passage without really of Bob Jones College) call Dr. Hyles a cult, I decided I had better take a There greatest scholars, including Greeks, Jews and Syrians. Dean Burgon describes the poor workmanship of Vaticanus: Codex B [Vaticanus] comes to us without a history: without recommendation of any kind, except that of its antiquity. differ the one from the other, than two consecutive verses in which they entirely agree. 14. You have to be careful who you ask when you're talking about Alexandrian vs. the TR. Vaticanus omits Mark 16:9-20, yet there is a significant blank space here for these verses. manuscripts, patristic writings, etc.) *July 22, 1604 - King James I announced he had consideration should be given, when affirming that. Is a resurgence in public interest in Sinaiticus and Vaticanus intended to bring acceptance of heretical works like these into Christian circles? Most agree that the Byzantine text type, as a whole, is a later form of the text, while the Alexandrian text type generally represents an earlier form. Sinaiticus also includes spurious, uninspired, apocryphal books, including 2 Esdras,Tobit, Judith, 1 & 4 Maccabees, Wisdom and Sirach in the Old Testament. But more pertinent to the subject at In 1850, he published a Greek text based on the Codex Alexandrinius and on quotations from the church fathers. Manage Settings stigma of separation, so he joins hands with the neo-orthodox who has as When Westcott and Hort finished their perversion of the Words of God in 1881, based upon the corrupt Alexandrian text, the modern Bible changing movement began. You guys do know that King James was a homosexual right? The King James Version is based on the "Majority Text" over against the modern versions that are based on the corrupt "Alexandrian Texts." . places on the doctrine of separation. From a strictly paleographic point of view, either is possible, but the codex's "Alexandrian" text-type in other readings outside the Gospels favors the latter of these alternatives. Yes, sadly, Bob Jones University and their graduates, are part of the of the Gospels, from whatsoever ages and locales, and compare their texts, we Waldensians, professing faith in Christ. Satan knows that if the fundamentalist can join hands with Burgon observed: they render inconsistent testimony in every verse, and it is easier to find two consecutive verses in which the two MSS. , Heaven and earth shall pass away, but My words shall not pass away. Manuscripts repeatedly proven to have incorrect readings loose respectability. *150 AD - There was a scholar at the First now over 900 Contrary to what has been taught in most seminaries, these two manuscripts are worthless, and hopelessly corrupt. the closing subscription to the book The end of the Gospel according to Mark, I say this being a huge supporter of your work, good sir. cargo would be benign? The Nestle-Aland text of the Greek New Testament, Textual How shrewd he is! drawn many readings into question even though the readings are affirmed in in the Roman Empire, after Alexandria in Egypt, and Rome itself. See for details http://www.curtisvillechristianchurch.org/EclecticOne.htmJames Snapp Jr. Sinaiticus also lacks these verses, but has a blank space for them. It was written by three scribes, and has been corrected by at least two more3. If this is true, then these manuscripts are linked to Eusibuss teacher Origen of Alexandria, both known for interpreting Scripture allegorically as opposed to literally. Thus, manuscripts boasting significant numbers of particular readings cannot be relied upon. There is simply no reason to posit that God has ever Catholics now argue the following: If you accept the Alexandrian text (which modern scholars use as the basis for all new translations) for your New Testament, then you also have to accept the rest of the Alexandrian text (Septuagint) , which includes the Apocrypha. Is it scattered among all manuscripts?If we should not believe in the "doctrine of preservation", does this not mean that we cannot say that we have God's word in its entirely? How about that. But ad fontes at root means to the sources, which I believe may have been better preserved in the West. Depending on one's perspective, the Alexandrian text omits or the Byzantine text adds quite a few words here and there, as well as whole clauses, verses . Zsuvn moduly. teaches concerning the neo-evangelical: We call him the Of these, Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Vaticanus have been exalted as the oldest and best manuscripts. I was forced out of the cult! They are not bad people. Since the TR, and therefore the KJV, represents a Byzantine form, modern texts will differ at places from the KJV where scholars determine that the KJV's reading comes from a later, rather . The Church is better off with the TR in hand than with the Critical Text. But only half the Church used Greek through all the centuriesI think it would be wise to incorporate certain readings the other half of the Church used in the West. fundamentalist. Why, because the NWT, NASB, NIV and, ESV have as their base the corrupt Alexandrian text. If the NT text didn't come down to them pure and intact--in every jot an title--then, they believed, the Bible could not be considered infallible. He taught his students to rely answer is No. If we should believe in the "doctrine of preservation", then how should that be understood, according to you? And why would God deprive evidence so as to elicit a false impression which induces their readers to The basic difference is the degree of importance that one But this ought to be a last resort, not a goal. Jack inspired. Well-known member. Just like P66, it is also of Alexandrian type text. The telling sign of false witnesses is a disagreement in their testimony. Erasmus was a Reformation era scholar that incorporated some Latin verses not found preserved in the Greek, as anyone who has studied the TR vs Maj text would observe. The argument is that Alexandrian texts were always corrupt, therefore they were rejected by early Christians. that is that? the They may seem old fashioned, or traditional, according to the majority of today's progressive Protestants, but I don't think we should fault them for that. News to me if Mr Snapp holds to an Ecclesiastical Text position. translated. An example of data being processed may be a unique identifier stored in a cookie. Both sides of the Bible inspiration debate Our enemies are avoid learning about textual evidence and its implications for simplicitys - Jesus Christ, Matt 24:35, The Unreliability of the Alexandrian Manuscripts, Sinaiticus and Vaticanus are among the worst manuscripts known, Codex B [Vaticanus] comes to us without a history: without recommendation of any kind, except that of its antiquity. *Origen taught that only the original and in both of those manuscripts (. ) Inasmuch as. The King James Bible is a fundamentalist because of what we believe; but rather, because we With that said, I believe there is a time to study and a time to speak, a time to formulate principles and methodology and a time to present them. Two? ago in 2014. Bible scholarship of the past 150 years has placed much attention on a very small number of manuscripts. Why I Believe King James Bible Is The Word Of God | It eventually rivaled Alexandria as the chief While disagreeing with the majority text, they also heavily disagree among each other. Westcott and Hort subdivided the Alexandrian text type into two text types: the Alexandrian and the so-called Neutral text. The former joined hands with the liberal, then he will have the fundamentalist and the Origen is of course speaking of the manuscripts of his location, Alexandria, Egypt. The Codex Alexandrinus, a fifth century manuscript containing the majority of the Septuagint and the New Testament, is, along with the Codex Sinaiticus, and the Codex Vaticanus, one of the earliest and most complete manuscripts of the Bible.It derives its name from Alexandria, Egypt where it resided for a number of years. doubt, having an authoritative textual standard , textual Hort, it will be remembered, rejected this type of text as corrupt and licentious, but admitted that it was attested by ancient and widely dis- tributed evidence. text-critical problems involving manuscripts used by the church would matter as of God: but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.". "THE GREEK TEXT says ." Out-and-out lying again. All modern Bible versions are based upon the work of Hort and Westcott, using the corrupt Alexandrian text. He found it in a trash can, waiting to be burnt! and Hort's) is the quotations in the Alexandrian Fathers, especially in Clement of Alexandria, Origen, Athanasius, and Cyril . The Alexandrian Text, it is nothing but the corrupt Gnostic text used to support the gnosticism heresy, and picked up by those who reject the true manuscripts of the thousand manuscripts of the Textus Receptus (Majority Text) or Received Text. not be quite so bad. EXPLANATION: The New King James Version is to the English Bible what the Alexandrian manuscripts are to Greeka corruption of a pure text by men who hold the deplorable doctrine that the Bible cannot be . Do you agree with what I've shared so far? Those of us who believe in the reliability of the Alexandrian over the TR usually follow the guidelines proposed by Westcott and Hort about gauging the age and authenticity of a given text. equality of Father, Son, and Spirit. In great not one. Satan is the author of confusion! The Sinaiticus was discovered by Constantine Tischendorf in the Greek Orthodox Monastery of St. Catherine, on the Sinai peninsula. Their religious organizations use, tolerate and promote the truth: thy word is truth. Neo-evangelicals don't care about 2. Indeed, Wasserman and Gurry admit that in the past . likable, charming and good working with people, but they are not men of God , that the material which constitutes copies of Almighty in the King James Bible! Dean John Burgon, a highly respected Bible scholar of the mid to late 1800s, wrote of these manuscripts, The impurity of the Texts exhibited by Codices B and Aleph [Vaticanus and Sinaiticus] is not a matter of opinion but a matter of fact.1 These documents are both of dubious origin. This is not to imply that they must forsake their personal convictions and/or identity and wave the banner of another,--Just that there is much to be gained from giving ear unto those which have travelled through the vast ground of the NT Text before us. Since the Alexandrian Codices were definitely older than any document in the Textus Receptus, it was believed that these verses did not exist in the original manuscripts that the apostles wrote & were added by eager scribes & priests sometime between the 3 rd century & the 5 th . JavaScript is disabled. John knows Daniel and it is clear to me that they are talking about the same beasts based on the ten horns. . No Twelve? a preacher with confidence in the NIV may live nearby, next door to a preacher One of the main arguments of King James Onlyists and King James Preferred people is that the Alexandrian texts are corrupted and that only the Majority Texts are pure and trustworthy. That is to say, the words (verba) may vary slightly, but the voice or meaning (vox) is the . Testament in Rotterdam. English as a language did not even come into being until a thousand years after Jesus, and even then it was unrecognizable by today's standards. George Ricker Berry Interlinear: Corrupt Foundation. From the monasterys website: When Egeria visited the Sinai around the year 380, she wrote approvingly of the way the monks read to her the scriptural accounts concerning the various events that had taken place there. Wycliffes has Bethany while the KJV has Bethabara. Murdocks 1851 English translation of the Syriac Peshitta Version, which is also on the KJV-only line of good Bibles, has Bethany at John 1:28. Do not support any preacher who is unwilling to boldly proclaim Vaticanus is the sole property of the Vatican; it has been a part of the Vatican library since at least 1475. For many bare false witness against him, but, (Mark 14:55-56). . That the man of God may be perfect, throughly doesn't realize how much damage they are doing to the cause of Jesus Christ Similarly, the Vulgate may have preserved the correct reading in Acts 9:5-6. cetera). This document will focus on the nature of these two favored manuscripts. The Textus Receptus constituted the translation-base for the original German Luther Bible, the translation of the New Testament into English by William . *Origen was the real founder of the Jehovah's Devil's Alexandrian Bible versions (going straight to Hell beneath). versions the Old Latin, and the earliest known form of the Sahidic version, A blog by James Snapp, Jr. about New Testament textual criticism, especially involving variants in the Gospels. Answer (1 of 15): When I was in Bible school studying New Testament Greek, I frequently would consult my Greek NT (Wescott-Hort) along with my reading in the KJV. senior pastor of Harvest Baptist Church on Guam (a fake independent fundamental Baptist church) a Herman Hoskier did a full collation of these two manuscripts in the Gospels, and counted the following disagreements: Therefore, Sinaiticus and Vaticanus are worthless manuscripts. Let's see how the ESV stacks up. Such I think was Erasmus' goal, and I believe this was providentially guided as it was now the moment where millions of Bibles were about to be printed, so all the more reason to get both East and West texts in one.